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.:Bob is not just for Christmas.....:.
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Sheriff John Stone
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 Posted April 26th, 2010 02:32 AM   IP              
Joni Mitchell's credibility, or lack of, aside, I'm more interested in the statement itself.

How much of the assertion has any merit, and, is any part of Dylan's legacy in danger of being questioned? I first heard some rumblings when Modern Times was released, but I didn't think it/they went anywhere. Are there any prior "serious" assertions, other than his name and the like?
   
Ian Cubed
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 Posted April 26th, 2010 06:26 AM   IP              
Many of his songs are based on traditional tunes and melodies, including Blowin' In The Wind and Girl From The North Country. He took credit for Alberta and Little Sadie on Self Portrait.
It is part of the whole tradition of songwriting to reinterpret and reinvent familiar material. A tradition that went far back beyond things such as copyrights, and one that won't be denied by laws.
   
Rob
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 Posted April 26th, 2010 10:00 AM   IP              
There have been things like lines from a novel called 'Confessions of a Yakuza' appearing in lyrics on (fittingly enough) Love and Theft. Not that it makes me think any the less of him or that album.

I was also quite amused by that story about the Hank Snow song about a dead dog which (with a few minor changes) he seemingly tried to pass off as his own (poetic) work as a 16 year old.


Have YOU been Con-Demed yet?
   
luther
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 Posted April 26th, 2010 01:49 PM   IP              
I guess the actual content of the rant--that Dylan uses other people's material--was something I've always heard. As long as I've known who he is, I had been told that. So maybe that's why it just doesn't affect me. My dad used to talk about him appropriating material ... but my dad was an early 60s folkie, and so did all of his favorites (appropriate material). Maybe that's why it's Mitchell's sad bitching that interests me more than the content itself. The substance just seems immaterial.
don't try so hard.
   
Rob
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 Posted April 28th, 2010 08:57 PM   IP              
Quote:
Ian Cubed wrote:
Considering Mitchell slept with all of CSN, she has no need to attack anyone else.


What? Wasn't poor old Y getting any?

Have YOU been Con-Demed yet?
   
Ian Cubed
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 Posted April 29th, 2010 12:07 AM   IP              
Quote:
Rob wrote:


What? Wasn't poor old Y getting any?


Nah, fellow Canadian. Grass always greener, ya know. Neil tried to grab her ass when he was standing next to her at The Last Waltz, and she gave him a "don't do that" look.
   
THE MIGHGTY MOOG HAM
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 Posted May 1st, 2010 07:54 PM   IP              
Quote:
After Joni Mitchell accused Bob Dylan of plagiarism, the blogosphere exploded and Dylan detractors cheered. Sean Wilentz on why they—and Joni—are wrong.

When Joni Mitchell trashed Bob Dylan in an interview with the Los Angeles Times last week, using words like “plagiarist,” “fake,” and “deception,” the music blogosphere caught fire. In one corner was a beloved singer-songwriter, in the other, a legend, someone who has been described as the supreme poet of rock 'n' roll.

Dylan’s defenders shot back at Mitchell, saying she acted like “a petulant child.” But Dylan’s detractors chortled: At last, a rock 'n' roll heavyweight had the courage to tell the truth about Dylan. “After decades of carefully manicured deification by Columbia Records,” wrote the music critic Jonny Whiteside, the time has come “to flout indoctrination and examine Dylan’s track record as a Grade-A phony.”

The idea that Dylan is a faker, unless everything he wrote came out of his own imagination—word for word, note for note—is absurd. By those standards, Franz Kafka is an unscrupulous plagiarist as is Aaron Copland and every jazz great.

It’s not clear how Mitchell defines “authentic” or what her definition might have to do with Dylan. That he changed his name from Robert Zimmerman is not exactly news, and it makes him no more deceptive than hundreds of other writers and artists ranging from B. Traven to Judy Garland. Nor do the numerous vocal stylizations Dylan has adopted over the years—imitated, mocked, but never replicated—mark him as a fraud.

The plagiarism charge, perhaps the gravest charge that can be leveled against any artist, is the one that matters, and it is important to look closely and calmly at Dylan’s work, if only to see how the charge misses the point of what Dylan has done, especially over the last decade or so.

Dylan would be the first to concede that he has borrowed from other writers and traditional folk and blues musicians from the very beginning of his career. The melody for “Blowing in the Wind” comes directly from an old spiritual “No More Auction Block,” and on a New York radio show in 1962, Dylan played a new song, “The Ballad of Emmett Till,” and off-handedly admitted that he had stolen the tune from another folksinger, Len Chandler. Only a few folkies complained, and then quickly fell silent—it transpired the complainers themselves had lifted some of their own tunes from others. Dylan’s method was fully in line with what Pete Seeger had called “the folk process,” borrowing freely from others to create something new.

Case closed. That is until 2003, when alert listeners noticed similarities between a few lines on Dylan’s highly acclaimed (and aptly named) album Love and Theft, and the English-language edition of an obscure oral history of a Japanese gangster, translated as Confessions of a Yakuza, by a physician and writer, Junichi Saga, from a small town north of Tokyo. Early appreciations of Love and Theft had noted how much of the album involved reworking earlier melodies and lyrics, including references to Donizetti and Bing Crosby as well as William Shakespeare. But the Yakuza discovery somehow seemed different. A closer look at the album’s songs, especially the track “Floater (Too Much to Ask),” showed about a dozen passages from Saga’s book that had ended up, without attribution, on Dylan’s album. The news became a front page story in The Wall Street Journal and caused the eminent critic Christopher Ricks, normally a defender of Dylan’s creative filching, to step back and say that the appropriation was “quite striking.” (When informed about Dylan’s use of his words, Saga reportedly said he felt honored, not abused.)

Three years later, when Dylan released Modern Times, listeners trawled for arcane references on the new album, and find them they did, including poetic fragments from Ovid and Henry Timrod, the second-rate pro-Confederate Southern poet. Apparently, the literary thievery was bounded by neither time nor space: Even a much-noted shout-out to rising star Alicia Keys in the song “Thunder On the Mountain” turned out to be a rephrasing of the old blues great Memphis Minnie’s tribute song, “Ma Rainey,” recorded in 1940. And so, even as Modern Times enjoyed huge sales and critical acclaim, earning Dylan two Grammies, it brought renewed clamor in the blogosphere as well as the pages of The New York Times, and suggestions that Dylan wasn’t a musical magpie but a plagiarist. And now along comes Joni.

It’s a controversy very much of our Internet age. Thanks to the increased sophistication of general-use search engines such as Google, as well as scanning technology and the appearance of literary and musical concordances online, dedicated sleuths can track down Dylan references without having to spend long hours at the library. High-profile cases of plagiarism by journalists, memoir writers, and historians have added to the frenzy.

At the most basic legal level, the charges of plagiarism are groundless. Almost all of the words and melodies that Dylan appropriated passed into the public domain long ago, and are free to use by anyone. Some argue that if Dylan used words and melodies by others on an album of supposedly original material, he ought to find a way to acknowledge as much, instead of claiming those words and melodies under his own copyright. But except for the Yakuza lines, most are isolated fragments—images and turns of phrase—that hardly compare to inventing a past or stealing scholarly research.

According to American copyright law, transforming the meaning of a copyrighted work can constitute fair use, and it seems that Dylan simply jotted down little phrases he found compelling in books and songs, and later used them for very different purposes in his own work. Indeed, Joni Mitchell herself told an interviewer that Dylan had explained to her that this was exactly his work method and how his ideas found spark.

The idea that Dylan is a faker, unless everything he wrote came out of his own imagination—word for word, note for note—is absurd. By those standards, Franz Kafka is an unscrupulous plagiarist as is Aaron Copland and every jazz great. As the music critic Jon Pareles has observed, all art—not just folk art—involves conversations with the past, battening on everything that the artist can find in culture and history rather than pretending that culture and history don’t exist. Pristine originality is not just impossible—it is fakery.

This isn’t a just matter of law or ethics. It’s a matter of the illusions we make in order to live, which is one definition of art. Dylan, an artist, steals what he loves and then loves what he steals by making it new.

Plus: Check out more of the latest entertainment, fashion, and culture coverage on Sexy Beast—photos, videos, features, and Tweets.

Sean Wilentz is a professor of history at Princeton University. His new book, Bob Dylan in America, from which portions of this article are drawn, will be published by Doubleday in December.


http://www.thedailybeast.com/blogs-...-dylan-a-phony/
   
Sheriff John Stone
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 Posted May 2nd, 2010 12:00 AM   IP              
The Mighty Moog Ham - thanks for the article! Looking forward to the new Dylan book, too.
   
Rob
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 Posted May 2nd, 2010 12:13 AM   IP              
"This isn’t a just matter of law or ethics. It’s a matter of the illusions we make in order to live, which is one definition of art. Dylan, an artist, steals what he loves and then loves what he steals by making it new."

I'd find all of this perfectly reasonable to swallow if Dylan wasn't such a hawk when it came to his own stuff on youtube etc.

Have YOU been Con-Demed yet?
   
luther
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 Posted May 2nd, 2010 12:33 AM   IP              
I find it easy to swallow in that it's human nature to be more forgiving of oneself taking liberties off others than of others doing it off you. Is the folk tradition some grand lovefest of everyone openly sharing? No, it's creative pilfering. It's often said it's common (which it is), but I don't know that anyone ever said it's common to enjoy being on the receiving end (or I guess the giving end, technically--the losing end).
don't try so hard.
   
Rob
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 Posted May 2nd, 2010 06:32 AM   IP              
Quote:
luther wrote:
Is the folk tradition some grand lovefest of everyone openly sharing?


I think actually at one time that was the general idea.

Have YOU been Con-Demed yet?
   
luther
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 Posted May 2nd, 2010 02:11 PM   IP              
Or at least marketed and/or remembered.
don't try so hard.
   
alan
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 Posted May 14th, 2010 02:07 PM   IP              
If anyone has a grand or two to spare.....

Bob Dylan to sell signed art prints in the UK The collection will go on sale from May 22
Bob Dylan is set to sell an assortment of signed art prints across the UK.

The collection of prints are taken from the singer-songwriter's The Drawn Blank Series, created between 1989 and 1992 whilst Dylan was on the road.

Hosted by Washington Green Fine Art Publishing, the pictures will be available to buy from May 22 from the Castle Galleries group of art stores, plus at other selected art galleries throughout the UK.

In previous years, prints from the folk legend have sold out quickly, with 2009's series selling for around £1,250 each.

For more information, visit CastleGalleries.com.
   
Rob
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 Posted May 14th, 2010 02:19 PM   IP              
Quote:
alan wrote:

In previous years, prints from the folk legend have sold out quickly, with 2009's series selling for around £1,250 each.

For more information, visit CastleGalleries.com.



Friend of mine bought this one (signed):

http://theworldthroughart.com/files...Two-Sisters.jpg

Have YOU been Con-Demed yet?
   
alan
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 Posted May 14th, 2010 03:44 PM   IP              
I remember we talked about these before - i went and saw the exhibition and thought some of them were pretty good - that was my favourite I think too.
   
alan
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 Posted May 24th, 2010 03:28 PM   IP              
Happy Birthday Bob!

69 years young today.

69......wow. And still out there on the road. Making great records. Being obtuse.

Amazing!
   
Rob
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 Posted May 24th, 2010 04:38 PM   IP              
Yep. Forever younger than that now.
Have YOU been Con-Demed yet?
   
Sheriff John Stone
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 Posted June 12th, 2010 05:29 AM   IP              
The Never Ending Tour continues, and look at some of these chestnuts from last night's setlist:

Prague, Czech Republic 6/11/10

1. Rainy Day Women #12 & #35
2. Lay Lady Lay
3. Just Like Tom Thumb's Blues
4. Just Like A Woman
5. Behind Here Lies Nothing
6. Shelter From The Storm
7. Honest With Me
8. Mr. Tambourine Man
9. Cold Iron's Bound
10. Workingman's Blues #2
11. Highway 61 Revisited
12. I Feel A Change Coming On
13. Thunder On The Mountain
14. Ballad Of A Thin man

Encores
15. Like A Rolling Stone
16. Jolene
17. All Along The Watchtower
   
Rob
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 Posted June 12th, 2010 07:58 AM   IP              
Bob gets on his bike.

http://starcasm.net/archives/51564

Have YOU been Con-Demed yet?
   
Sheriff John Stone
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 Posted June 13th, 2010 04:46 AM   IP              
Thanks for the link, Rob. I always like to read articles and see photos of Dylan out in the public. But....combat boots?
   
Sheriff John Stone
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 Posted June 28th, 2010 12:28 AM   IP              
Dylan played a set last night at the Azkena Rock Festival in Vitoria, Spain - on the Alex Chilton Stage! The Alex Chilton Stage?

Oh, yeah, look at this setlist:

1. Rainy Day Women #12 & 35
2. Don't Think Twice, It's Alright
3. Stuck Inside Of Mobile With The Memphis Blues Again
4. Just Like A Woman
5. Honest With Me
6. Simple Twist Of Fate
7. High Water (For Charley Patton)
8. Blind Willie McTell
9. Highway 61 Revisited
10. Shelter From The Storm
11. Thunder On The Mountain
12. Ballad Of A Thin Man

Encore:
13. Like A Rolling Stone

Charlie Sexton is still on guitar. Dylan is playing some dates back in the U.S. later this summer.
   
alan
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 Posted June 28th, 2010 02:11 AM   IP              
It's hard to see a Dylan set list that doesn't look good - they are just so short these days. He is getting on though.
   
Sheriff John Stone
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 Posted June 28th, 2010 02:28 AM   IP              
I think this most recent setlist was short(ened) by an encore or two because it was an appearance at a "festival" instead of a regular concert. You're right, though; Dylan's sets aren't the longest by any means.

We're starting to lose many of the great ones (see the latest Pete Quaife news), and I'm trying not to take these giants for granted. A surprising amount of the legends are still out there doing it. I'm trying to recognize and celebrate their passion. Actually, I think they're breaking new ground; playing into their 70's that is.
   
alan
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 Posted July 13th, 2010 09:21 PM   IP              
Another boot gets an official release!


06/07/2010 - Bob Dylan - 'Folksingers Choice'
"Not yet 21 and with his first album still unreleased, a largely unknown Bob Dylan was invited by New Yorks WBAI radio to perform a live broadcast for Cynthia Goodings Folksingers Choice programme on March 11th 1962. This legendary recording, available here for the first time, illustrates perfectly the scope and manner of Dylans live repertoire in the months leading up to his debut release. In addition to the three originals, all newly minted by Dylan, he covers songs by the likes of Hank Williams, Woody Guthrie and Big Joe Williams, but interestingly does not perform any tracks that would feature on his first record just weeks from release at the time of this broadcast. Folksingers Choice also contains the only known Dylan performances of Smokestack Lightning, Hard Travelin and Roll On, John and features the first known outings of The Death Of Emmett Till and Standing On The Highway. The 11 songs performed are liberally interspersed with chat between Bob and Cynthia, however, far from spoiling the show, this only go to enhance one of the best early recordings we have of Bob Dylan, making this CD an incredibly important early document" Released August 16th. £7.99




   
Sheriff John Stone
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 Posted July 25th, 2010 09:54 PM   IP              
So I'm watching one of those "history of rock & roll" shows on VH1, and Eric Burdon is interviewed about "The House Of The Rising Sun". Eric stated that it was THAT SONG that was the initial/real motivation behind Dylan electric ; that Dylan was impressed with how one his recordings would sound electrified. I never heard that before; any truth to Eric's story?
   
Ian Cubed
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 Posted July 25th, 2010 11:03 PM   IP              
Quote:
Sheriff John Stone wrote:
So I'm watching one of those "history of rock & roll" shows on VH1, and Eric Burdon is interviewed about "The House Of The Rising Sun". Eric stated that it was THAT SONG that was the initial/real motivation behind Dylan electric ; that Dylan was impressed with how one his recordings would sound electrified. I never heard that before; any truth to Eric's story?


Well, Tom Wilson did try to overdub electric backing onto Dylan's House Of The Rising Sun, before he did the same successfully with S&G's Sound Of Silence.
   
alan
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 Posted July 26th, 2010 01:39 AM   IP              
There is a band as early as Mixed Up Confusion of course. It may have been The Animals or it may have been more of a general desire to use a band anyway. It couldn't have been the influence of The Byrds though as he was recording 'Bringing It All Back Home in January 65, before The Byrds recorded Tambourine Man, which was released on that album. I've heard enough critics say it was though which makes no sense at all.
   
Ian Cubed
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 Posted July 28th, 2010 12:48 AM   IP              
Quote:
In October, Sony Legacy be releasing The Bootleg Series Vol. 9, and a box set of the first eight Bob Dylan albums in mono. The official announcement is expected to be made next month.

The Bootleg Series will be “a set of non-live recordings, well-known to collectors”. It is based on the "Witmark Demos", but is expected to include some "Leeds Demos" as well. A total of 47 tracks are expected to be included.

The first Bob Dylan eight albums. from Bob Dylan to John Wesley Harding, were originally available in mono. They have never officially been available on compact disc before. Throughout most of the 1960s, more attention had been paid to monaural mixes than stereo. However, but the end of the decade, mono was phased out in favor of stereo. The new CDs were reportedly newly mastered, with "using first issue copies of the mono LPs for reference".
   
alan
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 Posted July 28th, 2010 01:49 AM   IP              
How many other people would have reached this point in unreleased stuff and still be releasing such great stuff?

And they haven't even got to the Basement Tapes yet!

Not sure i'm overly excited about the mono albums. I have a Blonde On Blonde d'lded from either the Smile Shop or The Record Room and its fine, but i don't know how much i want to buy them all again.
   
Sheriff John Stone
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 Posted July 28th, 2010 02:06 AM   IP              
What are the Witmark demos and Leeds demos?
   



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